Encryption removal

I have an Excel file that I encrypted. I wish to remove the encryption.

After encrytion of this file, I was required by Dell to reload my OS
(Windows XP SP2) on my home computer due to a problem they could not
otherwise solve. Prior to the reload I had copied the Excel file to an
external drive. After bringing my computer back up, I find I cannot open the
Excel file because "The document may be read-only or encrypted". It's not
read-only, but it was/is encrypted. Since I can't access it, I attempted to
remove the encryption via "Properties, Attributes (Advanced)" and removing
the check mark from "Encrypt contents to secure data". I tried to apply this
but got "An error occurred applying attributes to the file ....... " and
nothing changed.

So in the "Advanced Attributes" dialog box I clicked on details and was
shown "Users Who Can Transparently Access This File" dialog box which
included the User Name "Dick ........" (which is me, the system
administrator). I high-lighted "Dick..." and clicked on "Add" and got the
"Certificate"
display - under the General tab it indicated "This CA Root certificate is
not to be trusted. To enable trust, install this certificate in the Trusted
Root Certificates Authorities store."

I'm wondering if this may not be the reason why I can't open or change the
encryption of the Excel file. I'm also at a loss as to how to "install this
certificate in the Trusted Root Certificates Authorities store". I've
searched the Microsoft knowledge base but have yet to discover if this might
be the problem or how to do this install.

Can someone help or point me to a place that might help ?

If you don't have a backup copy of the original encryption key or a recovery certificate,
you won't be able to access your encrypted files. Reinstalling Windows XP won't work
either since the security ID will be different.

--
Carey Frisch
Microsoft MVP
Windows Desktop Experience -
Windows Vista Enthusiast

---------------------------------------------------------------

"Richard" <Richard@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message news:29A14008-43E0-4011-9796-B862377AAC5D@microsoft.com...
I have an Excel file that I encrypted. I wish to remove the encryption.

After encrytion of this file, I was required by Dell to reload my OS
(Windows XP SP2) on my home computer due to a problem they could not
otherwise solve. Prior to the reload I had copied the Excel file to an
external drive. After bringing my computer back up, I find I cannot open the
Excel file because "The document may be read-only or encrypted". It's not
read-only, but it was/is encrypted. Since I can't access it, I attempted to
remove the encryption via "Properties, Attributes (Advanced)" and removing
the check mark from "Encrypt contents to secure data". I tried to apply this
but got "An error occurred applying attributes to the file ....... " and
nothing changed.

So in the "Advanced Attributes" dialog box I clicked on details and was
shown "Users Who Can Transparently Access This File" dialog box which
included the User Name "Dick ........" (which is me, the system
administrator). I high-lighted "Dick..." and clicked on "Add" and got the
"Certificate"
display - under the General tab it indicated "This CA Root certificate is
not to be trusted. To enable trust, install this certificate in the Trusted
Root Certificates Authorities store."

I'm wondering if this may not be the reason why I can't open or change the
encryption of the Excel file. I'm also at a loss as to how to "install this
certificate in the Trusted Root Certificates Authorities store". I've
searched the Microsoft knowledge base but have yet to discover if this might
be the problem or how to do this install.

Can someone help or point me to a place that might help ?

On Sun, 22 Jun 2008 12:06:00 -0700, Richard
<Richard@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote:

>I have an Excel file that I encrypted. I wish to remove the encryption.
>
>After encrytion of this file, I was required by Dell to reload my OS
>(Windows XP SP2) on my home computer due to a problem they could not
>otherwise solve. Prior to the reload I had copied the Excel file to an
>external drive. After bringing my computer back up, I find I cannot open the
>Excel file because "The document may be read-only or encrypted". It's not
>read-only, but it was/is encrypted. Since I can't access it, I attempted to
>remove the encryption via "Properties, Attributes (Advanced)" and removing
>the check mark from "Encrypt contents to secure data". I tried to apply this
>but got "An error occurred applying attributes to the file ....... " and
>nothing changed.
>
>So in the "Advanced Attributes" dialog box I clicked on details and was
>shown "Users Who Can Transparently Access This File" dialog box which
>included the User Name "Dick ........" (which is me, the system
>administrator). I high-lighted "Dick..." and clicked on "Add" and got the
>"Certificate"
>display - under the General tab it indicated "This CA Root certificate is
>not to be trusted. To enable trust, install this certificate in the Trusted
>Root Certificates Authorities store."
>
>I'm wondering if this may not be the reason why I can't open or change the
>encryption of the Excel file. I'm also at a loss as to how to "install this
>certificate in the Trusted Root Certificates Authorities store". I've
>searched the Microsoft knowledge base but have yet to discover if this might
>be the problem or how to do this install.
>
>Can someone help or point me to a place that might help ?
>
>
Another example of why HOME users have no need of encryption. What
state leve secrets were you protecting? There are easier ways to hide
the location of your porn.

"Richard" <Richard@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message
news:29A14008-43E0-4011-9796-B862377AAC5D@microsoft.com...
>I have an Excel file that I encrypted. I wish to remove the encryption.
>
> After encrytion of this file, I was required by Dell to reload my OS
> (Windows XP SP2) on my home computer due to a problem they could not
> otherwise solve. Prior to the reload I had copied the Excel file to an
> external drive. After bringing my computer back up, I find I cannot open
> the
> Excel file because "The document may be read-only or encrypted". It's not
> read-only, but it was/is encrypted. Since I can't access it, I attempted
> to
> remove the encryption via "Properties, Attributes (Advanced)" and removing
> the check mark from "Encrypt contents to secure data". I tried to apply
> this
> but got "An error occurred applying attributes to the file ....... " and
> nothing changed.
> ...

A little more is required than removing the "encrypted" property.
What _is_ required is actually decrypting the encrypted information.
Your approach is certainly original though. Think of how WWII could
have been shortened if only we could have taken encrypted Japanese
and German transmissions and have removed the property of being
encrypted from them.

1) Find the password.

2) Find the encryption method.

3) Run 2) in reverse using 1).

4) Lacking both 1) _and_ 2), go find a corner and weep in it.

Carey

I think what you're telling me is that I lost the original encryption key
when I reloaded the OS. Is that correct ?

Since I did a full backup of my Hard Drive to an External Drive prior to the
reload, is it possible I still have a copy the needed (original) encrytion
key on my external drive ?

Richard

"Carey Frisch [MVP]" wrote:

> If you don't have a backup copy of the original encryption key or a recovery certificate,
> you won't be able to access your encrypted files. Reinstalling Windows XP won't work
> either since the security ID will be different.
>
> --
> Carey Frisch
> Microsoft MVP
> Windows Desktop Experience -
> Windows Vista Enthusiast
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------
>
> "Richard" <Richard@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message news:29A14008-43E0-4011-9796-B862377AAC5D@microsoft.com...
> I have an Excel file that I encrypted. I wish to remove the encryption.
>
> After encrytion of this file, I was required by Dell to reload my OS
> (Windows XP SP2) on my home computer due to a problem they could not
> otherwise solve. Prior to the reload I had copied the Excel file to an
> external drive. After bringing my computer back up, I find I cannot open the
> Excel file because "The document may be read-only or encrypted". It's not
> read-only, but it was/is encrypted. Since I can't access it, I attempted to
> remove the encryption via "Properties, Attributes (Advanced)" and removing
> the check mark from "Encrypt contents to secure data". I tried to apply this
> but got "An error occurred applying attributes to the file ....... " and
> nothing changed.
>
> So in the "Advanced Attributes" dialog box I clicked on details and was
> shown "Users Who Can Transparently Access This File" dialog box which
> included the User Name "Dick ........" (which is me, the system
> administrator). I high-lighted "Dick..." and clicked on "Add" and got the
> "Certificate"
> display - under the General tab it indicated "This CA Root certificate is
> not to be trusted. To enable trust, install this certificate in the Trusted
> Root Certificates Authorities store."
>
> I'm wondering if this may not be the reason why I can't open or change the
> encryption of the Excel file. I'm also at a loss as to how to "install this
> certificate in the Trusted Root Certificates Authorities store". I've
> searched the Microsoft knowledge base but have yet to discover if this might
> be the problem or how to do this install.
>
> Can someone help or point me to a place that might help ?
>
>
>
>

=?Utf-8?B?UmljaGFyZA==?= <Richard@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote
in news:3AAC8B09-143D-4787-B886-1EE57010EA7E@microsoft.com:

> Carey
>
> I think what you're telling me is that I lost the original
> encryption key when I reloaded the OS. Is that correct ?

Yes.

>
> Since I did a full backup of my Hard Drive to an External Drive
> prior to the reload, is it possible I still have a copy the needed
> (original) encrytion key on my external drive ?
>
> Richard

It depends on what a "full backup" is. If you can completely restore
your old operating system from this backup, then boot from it and login
using your old login and password, then maybe you can recover it.
Usually this is only possible with an "image"-style backup.

Good Luck,
John

I said "backup" but in reality I did a drop and drop copy of all the various
directories. I don't believe this is considered an image style backup but
please correct me if I'm wrong.

"John Wunderlich" wrote:

> =?Utf-8?B?UmljaGFyZA==?= <Richard@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote
> in news:3AAC8B09-143D-4787-B886-1EE57010EA7E@microsoft.com:
>
> > Carey
> >
> > I think what you're telling me is that I lost the original
> > encryption key when I reloaded the OS. Is that correct ?
>
> Yes.
>
> >
> > Since I did a full backup of my Hard Drive to an External Drive
> > prior to the reload, is it possible I still have a copy the needed
> > (original) encrytion key on my external drive ?
> >
> > Richard
>
> It depends on what a "full backup" is. If you can completely restore
> your old operating system from this backup, then boot from it and login
> using your old login and password, then maybe you can recover it.
> Usually this is only possible with an "image"-style backup.
>
> Good Luck,
> John
>

On Tue, 24 Jun 2008 14:17:00 -0700, Richard
<Richard@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote:

>I said "backup" but in reality I did a drop and drop copy of all the various
>directories. I don't believe this is considered an image style backup but
>please correct me if I'm wrong.
>
>"John Wunderlich" wrote:
>
>> =?Utf-8?B?UmljaGFyZA==?= <Richard@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote
>> in news:3AAC8B09-143D-4787-B886-1EE57010EA7E@microsoft.com:
>>
>> > Carey
>> >
>> > I think what you're telling me is that I lost the original
>> > encryption key when I reloaded the OS. Is that correct ?
>>
>> Yes.
>>
>> >
>> > Since I did a full backup of my Hard Drive to an External Drive
>> > prior to the reload, is it possible I still have a copy the needed
>> > (original) encrytion key on my external drive ?
>> >
>> > Richard
>>
>> It depends on what a "full backup" is. If you can completely restore
>> your old operating system from this backup, then boot from it and login
>> using your old login and password, then maybe you can recover it.
>> Usually this is only possible with an "image"-style backup.
>>
>> Good Luck,
>> John
>>
No it's not. Your hosed. See why encryption isn't a good idea to
protect your porn?

By the way, replies go down HERE.

"Gurney" <none@nobody.net> wrote in message
news:d9v2645jicj6m0cdvp5n4vmvpni2k241sb@4ax.com...
> On Tue, 24 Jun 2008 14:17:00 -0700, Richard
> <Richard@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote:
>
>>I said "backup" but in reality I did a drop and drop copy of all the
>>various
>>directories. I don't believe this is considered an image style backup but
>>please correct me if I'm wrong.
...
> No it's not. Your hosed. See why encryption isn't a good idea to
> protect your porn?
>
> By the way, replies go down HERE.
>

Give Richard a break, it could have been the family investment
records. But in any case, encryption is a very useful but, in
careless hands, very dangerous tool for hiding things. I'd
recommend two steps: before encryption, make a backup
copy of the private data, and _hide_it_really_well_. The bottom
of the underwear drawer is not "really well". Protected with
nested wrappings and buried when no-one is
looking in a place not easily guessed at is pretty much
"really well". Tucked into an unlikely place in the
construction of a really trustworthy friend's house, likewise.
Step two, encrypt, and _do_not_lose_or_reveal_the_key_,
then do a true image backup as part of your regular backup
procedures. An image is an absolutely total copy of your
hard disk partition, and when you use it to restore, everything
without exception in the partition is restored to its state
when you did the backup, bit by damned bit, and all changes
since the backup, also without any exception, are lost.

"Anthony Buckland" <anthonybucklandnospam@telus.net> wrote in message
news:urcNVgO1IHA.4572@TK2MSFTNGP03.phx.gbl...
>
> "Richard" <Richard@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message
> news:29A14008-43E0-4011-9796-B862377AAC5D@microsoft.com...
>>I have an Excel file that I encrypted. I wish to remove the encryption.
>>
>> After encrytion of this file, I was required by Dell to reload my OS
>> (Windows XP SP2) on my home computer due to a problem they could not
>> otherwise solve. Prior to the reload I had copied the Excel file to an
>> external drive. After bringing my computer back up, I find I cannot open
>> the
>> Excel file because "The document may be read-only or encrypted". It's not
>> read-only, but it was/is encrypted. Since I can't access it, I attempted
>> to
>> remove the encryption via "Properties, Attributes (Advanced)" and
>> removing
>> the check mark from "Encrypt contents to secure data". I tried to apply
>> this
>> but got "An error occurred applying attributes to the file ....... " and
>> nothing changed.
>> ...
>
> A little more is required than removing the "encrypted" property.
> What _is_ required is actually decrypting the encrypted information.
> Your approach is certainly original though. Think of how WWII could
> have been shortened if only we could have taken encrypted Japanese
> and German transmissions and have removed the property of being
> encrypted from them.
>
> 1) Find the password.
>
> 2) Find the encryption method.
>
> 3) Run 2) in reverse using 1).
>
> 4) Lacking both 1) _and_ 2), go find a corner and weep in it.

Unfortunately the Windows EFS scheme does not rely on the password. You
have to have the user account in *original running condition*, or backed-up
credentials, or a pre-defined recovery agent to decrypt the files.
Having the password will get you nowhere.

Yes, it seems that the OP has permanently lost access to the encrypted
files.

MS did a really good job at making strong encryption easily available, but
nowhere near as good a job at making sure users had to protect themselves
from its consequences. It should be mandatory to back up the credentials,
at very least, but it isn't.

There's no happy ending to this story, once again.

-pk